quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:
Well if you want cheap:
The Education of the Negro Prior to 1861 by Carter Godwin Woodson
http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/11089

umbra

I finally sat down to read this and it was really informative... esp. about the Quakers' contribution to civil rights.

It's answered a few questions ~ thanks.
.

Any time.

Have you ever encountered this?

http://www.ipgbook.com/showbook.cfm?bookid=0883781352&u...B7A-7056B3D47D65994F

umbra

quote:

Have you ever encountered this?

http://www.ipgbook.com/showbook.cfm?bookid=0883781352&u...B7A-7056B3D47D65994F

No, I haven't heard of this, thanks, I'll check it out.
Have you read it? What's your opinion of it?

I've been away on holiday up north (but now I'm back ) and been reading James Baldwin's The Fire Next Time. A powerful book on many levels, and the most illuminating, and lucid description of being an African American man that I have ever read.
.

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by FireFly:
No, I haven't heard of this, thanks, I'll check it out.
Have you read it? What's your opinion of it?

Now you've done it. You've gotten me mad.

I bought it and read it twice. I was going to quote some stuff I highlighted. Now I can't find it. It's around here somewhere. That's the trouble with single men, there apartments are always a mess.

One of the things that struck me while reading the book, I was often saying to myself, "Damn, that sounds just like something I would write." You know how modest I am. LOL

Mo only negative comments about the book center on his book list, but that also brings up an interesting issue. He has a list of almost 300 books and the books are categorized by Black and non-Black authors and just listed alphabetically by author within those categories. It would never occur to me to do that. I had a website up for a while with a book list and they were separated by fiction and non-fiction.

The only book relating to economics was one by Dempsey Travis a Black real estate investor. There was nothing about technology which was kin of odd considering a story he told about airplanes as a child. He just lists the books by title and author with no comment or prioritization. I found this very peculiar. Reading one book per week would take almost 6 years, surely some information should be more urgent and useful to most people. It would be real annoying after 4 years of reading to say, "Damn! I wish I had known this 3 years ago."

I guess English professors have to be wordy.

http://www.purdue.edu/UNS/html3month/021010.Washington.note.html

umbra

Beware of Vulcans from the Dark Side

This message has been edited. Last edited by: FireFly,

quote:

Now I can't find it. It's around here somewhere. That's the trouble with single men, there apartments are always a mess.

Now you've fessed up, you know you've got to go find it!
Do you have a typewriter amongst all that mess? As you're aware, that's BC the PC and a different animal altogether. Just perversely curious.

quote:

One of the things that struck me while reading the book, I was often saying to myself, "Damn, that sounds just like something I would write." You know how modest I am. LOL

heck, I'm always saying that about you.... umm

quote:

My only negative comments about the book center on his book list

speaking of which... do you speak/read French? This would add a few 1000 pages to your reading list.

quote:

The only book relating to economics

ok... I'm gonna have to plug Gittinomics - by Ross Gittins - an Aussie and a big seller over here [9781741750928]. Also, I noticed a rerelease of an oldie called "Small is Beautiful: Economics as if People Mattered" quite a title, although you know how few economics titles I read... but here's an online review:

This I Believe and Other Essays
E.F. Schumacher

Years after his death, the ideas of E.F. Schumacher still resonate through the environmental movement. With deep spiritual vision and rejection of Western materialism and economic exploitation, Schumacher saw the need to give societies, communities and individuals practical tools for change. He is best known for his book "Small is Beautiful: Economics as if People Mattered", which became an international best-seller. Both activist and philosopher, his concerns included economics, energy, farming, industry and the inner life of human beings. He was for many years Chief Economist to the Coal Board, and latterly Chairman of the Soil Association; he also originated the concept of intermediate technology. His enduring influence has been recognised by the setting up in 1992 of Schumacher College, an international college for ecological and spiritual values, and the Schumacher Society, which was established in 1977. Over a period of eight years, Fritz Schumacher used the pages of "Resurgence" magazine to develop the ideas that were to become the basis of "Small is Beautiful". This book brings together all his articles for "Resurgence", including "Insane Work Cannot Produce a Sane Society", "Science with Soul", "Western Europe's Energy Crisis", "How to Abolish Land Speculation" and "The Critical Question of Size". The book aims to introduce to a new audience the freshness, clarity and profundity of Schumacher's thinking, which has inspired a generation.

ISBN 9781870098663

NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!

You can get me once, you can't get me twice.

I've got this, Small is Beautiful: Economics as if People Mattered. I read it back in the 70's. And I know where it is. It's in the "dining room" holding up the corner of a big laser printer with a broken wheel. It's on top of a telephone book. What can I say, it was the right thickness.

Damn, I'm good.

umbra

so I'll expect a Review soon then?

quote:

so I'll expect a Review soon then? Razz Big Grin

There is this really cool line in the movie Beneath the Planet of the Apes where Taylor (Heston) asks this mutant, "When can I expect to be set free?"

And the mutie responds, "You can expect anything you want."

Logic can really be annoying sometimes.

No, I am not reading Small is Beautiful again. I'm reading I. Asimov, the autobiography of Isaac Asimov and listening to an audio book of State of Denial. Rumsfeld is a real a$$hole. And Bush senior knew it but Junior wouldn't listen.

umbra

quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:
There is this really cool line in the movie Beneath the Planet of the Apes where Taylor (Heston) asks this mutant, "When can I expect to be set free?"

And the mutie responds, "You can expect anything you want."

Logic can really be annoying sometimes.
umbra

to which I can only reply:
"It feels so good to be unique even if the cost is shoddy logic!"
~ Barney Oliver

quote:

Originally posted by FireFly:
to which I can only reply:
"It feels so good to be unique even if the cost is shoddy logic!"
~ Barney Oliver

You mean anybody can't expect anything they want? LOL

Of course I had to look that guy up.

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/b/barney_oliver.html

um

This message has been edited. Last edited by: umbrarchist,

Physics - don't - LIE!

quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:
Any time.

Have you ever encountered this?

http://www.ipgbook.com/showbook.cfm?bookid=0883781352&u...B7A-7056B3D47D65994F

I found it

I have got highlighting on a third of the pages and now I can't make up my mind what to key in.

um

quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:

I found it

I have got highlighting on a third of the pages and now I can't make up my mind what to key in.

um

is your star sign Libra?

quote:

Originally posted by FireFly:

is your star sign Libra?

Nosey!

What makes you think I'm Libra?

http://africanamerica.org/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/844605126/...011040714#6011040714


This is in the first page of the introduction:

quote:

In a Nwesweek essay (1-21-80), the scientist/writer Isaac Asimov wrote about the "cult of ignorance" in this country. He said, "The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant threat winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that `my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'"

Ignorance about the state of Black people in America is appalling. However what is even more appalling is that few people in the dominant culture even give damn, and too many African American leaders have no idea how to improve the lives of their people.

umbra

quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:

What makes you think I'm Libra?

it's a joke... Librans are characteristically known to avoid making decisions.

quote:

http://africanamerica.org/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/844605126/...011040714#6011040714

a Pisces huh? ( )

quote:

This is in the first page of the introduction:

quote:

In a Nwesweek essay (1-21-80), the scientist/writer Isaac Asimov wrote about the "cult of ignorance" in this country. He said, "The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant threat winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that `my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'"

Ignorance about the state of Black people in America is appalling. However what is even more appalling is that few people in the dominant culture even give damn, and too many African American leaders have no idea how to improve the lives of their people.

umbra

well this is very nice, thank you, but Um, I seem to recall asking your opinion of the book ... not Isaac's!
You just want me to go buy it for myself, don't you.

That wasn't Asimov's opinion of the book. That quote was his comment on American society in 1980, long before the book was written. But that was the first thing I highlighted in the book. I think the fact that the author selected it and put it in such a prominent place influenced my decision to buy it. Actually the fact that I finished it is a commentary, If it is hard for me to get passed page 20 I usually trash the book.

I said there is highlighting on 1/3rd of the pages. What do you want me to do, type in all of them?

Don't bother answering that, it ain't happenin'.

um

quote:

Originally posted by umbrarchist:

I said there is highlighting on 1/3rd of the pages. What do you want me to do, type in all of them?

Don't bother answering that, it ain't happenin'.

um

it's called a summary...lol

1. a comprehensive and usually brief abstract, recapitulation, or compendium of previously stated facts or statements.
–adjective
2. brief and comprehensive; concise.

Ideally, these contain salient points.

Here are some 5-star reviews:

SOUL-SEARING, ESSENTIAL WORDS FOR BROTHERS AND SISTERS....., July 10, 2001
Reviewer: Lorrie Irby (Dallas, Tx USA) - See all my reviews
This eloquent, yet hard-hitting book gives a blueprint, instructions and provocative reasoning behind why Black families are in crisis today, and most of his criticsm is leveled at the "men" in the Black community who have yet to step up to the plate and claim their rightful responsibilities in the home and in the world. In often humorous ways, Haki breaks down what the issues are, where the solutions lie and what we should demand of each other in our collective struggle (from our Black mates, children, leaders, etc.). He does all of this without being condescending or pious, but stern and loving, an accomplishment in itself, and I recommend this to any Black person commited to the struggle to make lives better for Blacks in this country as a whole, starting in their own backyards. If more Black men took these word to heart, the world would be a better place for all brothers and sisters. VITAL, CRUCIAL and NECESSARY!!!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
4 of 5 people found the following review helpful:

A MUST READING, August 20, 2000
Reviewer: Samuel C. Hall (Hempstead, NY 11550) - See all my reviews
This book is a must reading for those who are serious about advancement for those of african desecnt. The author hits on several critical points, and he does an excellent job at providing solutions. THIS BOOK WILL OPEN YOUR MIND!

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
4 of 4 people found the following review helpful:
BLACK PEOPLE - MANDATORY READING, February 17, 2000
Reviewer: Christina Donoghue (Sydney, Australia) - See all my reviews
Understand yourself and the world around you in a way that you never had before.

ALL black people need to read this book!

You will not be able to put this down as you read about the simplest differences between you and your white equivelent. Madhabutis' almost poetic language is peaceful to read.

If you're a black person who believes that change is necessary but you don't know what to do about it, the educative source is right in front of you, it's now up to you.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
7 of 8 people found the following review helpful:
THIS BOOK IS A LANDMARK IN BLACK THOUGHT!, September 28, 1998
Reviewer: A reader
AN EXCELLENT BOOK. I RECOMMEND ALL BLACK MEN TO READ THE THOUGHTS AND IDEAS THAT MR. MADHUBUTI HAS TO SAY IN THIS THOUGHT PROVOKING BOOK DEALING WITH THE LIFE AND STRUGGLE OF THE SO CALLED AFRICAN AMERICAN MALE. THIS BOOK WILL HELP ANY BLACK MAN SEEKING KNOWLEDGE FIND ENLIGHTENMENT.

http://www.amazon.com/Black-Men-Obsolete-Single-Dangerous/dp/0883781352

Those reviews are all somewhat stronger than mine and don't criticise anything about the book. The book has a section called:

Never Without a Book: 200 books All Black People Should Study

There is a book list that starts on page 135 and ends on page 155. The list contains a total of 349 books. He classifies the books by Black and non-Black authors. 253 of the books are by Black authors and 96 by others. Now which of these books qualify among the 200 that we should all study, I have no idea. It struck me as odd from the beginning that he classified them in that manner. I would have gone with fiction and non-fiction as my first level of classification.

The only book I see relating to economics in a personal way is:

Real Estate is the Gold in Your Future by Dempsey Travis

Other stuff related to economics is:

The Nature of Mass Poverty by John Kenneth Galbraith

Wealth and Poverty by George Gilder

Vicious Circles: The Mafia in the Market Place by Jonathan Zwitny

There is nothing there of significance about technology which is a little odd considering a story he tells about his mother involving a toy airplane.

Future Shock and The Third Wave by Alvin Toffler

are in the list but they are about social and economic impacts of technology not technology itself.

This is a curious episode of Voyager. It reminds me of Black neighborhoods. All this talk about racism and slavery and reparations and wasting resources competing with each other over bullsh!t. We have computers and network access to share info like never before but I have seen a long thread about a Black baby with blue eyes. That is more important than global warming.

The Chute
http://www.tv-links.co.uk/link.do/1/1540/2196/18453/29677

It's curious how they can portray police and "justice systems" as bad in fiction yet they are so much like their own in reality.

umbra

I don't remember mentioning real estate or economics, BUT, wow, that's a herculean effort Umbra, thank you.

The reason I kept pushing for some verbage on Madhubuti's book was because I was hoping you might offer a few words from your perspective ... being male, having read it, made copious use of a highlighter pen, and said...

quote:

One of the things that struck me while reading the book, I was often saying to myself, "Damn, that sounds just like something I would write."

but if you don't want to share [FF crosses arms] then that's ok.
But only by a...

Herculean?

I just don't see my choices as being important to the value of the book. In fact I don't think it would be things that I strongly agreed with that I would highlight. There is one spot where I highlighted something and wrote NO! next to it.

This book is similar to Souls of Black Folks in its perspective but it is far more up to date. Du Boise is way over the hill and time moves faster these days. Madhubuti is an English professor. Though he talks about tech he isn't into it. And like it or not that is where we are headed but we need to stop being stupid with it.

quote:

The Afrikans have a saying: "If you don't know who you are, any history will do."

Afrikan American people have little knowledge of themselves. We are products of a slave history, a Eurocentric worldview, that by definition cannot be developmental or inspirational. This history, for the most part, has been written, disseminated and taught by the sons and daughters of the people who raped Afrika of its people and wealth and literally sprinkled Afrikans around the world. They, while doing this, developed (created) in their politics, science, arts, economics, education and religion a rationale for Black destruction. This Eurocentric rationale provided the "intellectual and moral" basis for their taking of the world. Thereafter the world was divided into colors - Black, white and others.

Not Knowing and Not Wanting to Know

The education I received in the Black community was entirely different - in content and context - from that of whites. Not only was my "training" not a challenge, it was discouraging. The major piece of information I absorbed after twelve years of public education was that I was a problem, inferior, ineducable and a victim. And, as a victim, I began to see the world through the eyes of a victim.

That is from page ii of the introduction.

The above paragraphs remind me of an incident from just before I graduated from grammar school. A Catholic high school in a White neighborhood was offering a 4 year scholarship to whoever scored best on some test they were giving so I decided to give it a shot. The strange thing was sitting in the waiting room before the test with all of those White boys. The way they looked at me I figured they were wondering what I was doing there and thought it was odd that I would think I had a chance. I presume I didn't win since I never heard but I figure it would have been hell trying to get thru that school if I had.

Another thing about his book is that Black is always capitalized and White is not when referring to Black and White people. I found that hilarious.

This business about history, science and economics is very important. In all of the time we have had Black History Month in the US I have never heard a good explanation of the significance of the cotton gin brought up. Before that invention there was not much cotton grown in the US. The cotton gin increased the efficiency of extracting the seeds from the cotton fiber by a factor of 25 or more. This changed the entire economics of cotton production and vastly increased the incentive to grow cotton so millions of acres were planted within a couple of decades of the introduction of the device. Talking about Black history in the US without bringing that up is a farce. But it is also a good example of how changing technology changes the workings of the economy.

This is a lot more complicated than a cotton gin:



There are undoubtedly more devices like this then there ever were cotton gins and they present more options on how the society evolves. But the people that lose in the coming cyber-evolution of society may be techn-slaves for a long time.

umbra

This message has been edited. Last edited by: umbrarchist,

Physics - don't - LIE!