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D3 |
Is love blind?
 I once met a very attractive, articulate, professional black man at a charity event. I was so excited to meet him that night that I even added a comment about him during the speech I gave later that evening. Following the speech, I eagerly approached him at his table. He smiled and we talked for a moment before he politely introduced me to his girlfriend. I was disappointed that he was involved in a relationship, and to be honest, I was even more disappointed and shocked that his partner was a very, very average and portly looking white woman. Shocking but as time passed it was a very common observance. Black men leaping over stunning and together black woman for ANYTHING white. Despite my disappointment, we exchanged business cards and agreed to stay in touch, which we did. Over the years, my new friend told me about the difficulties of his relationship. His girlfriend apparently had repeatedly cheated on him, which actually surprised me. From my perspective, the girlfrien definintley had the better end of the deal. She had no reason to be cheating on my friend. For the life of me, I could not understand why my friend was so upset about the end of this relationship. From my narrow perspective, he should have been happy to be free to find a better partner. But love doesn't let go easily. My friend was heartbroken, and I was confused. I had tried to make my friend into something he wasn't. I had wanted him to date black women also, like himself, but he seemed so uninterested. He was totally against opening up that racial option, and he was a black man!!!! I had learned something new about interracial dating. Some black men simply aren't interested in other black women. Another friend, a successful black professional, often complained to me that he could not find black women of his "caliber." Black women, he said, were often loud and difficult and uneducated with 2 or 3 children. After searching for a year or two, he settled down in a relationship with a white woman who worked as a nurses assistant and had THREE KIDS. It seems my friend was actually less interested in his partner's caliber than in his race. Why couldn't he just tell the truth? He did not want to date a black women!! He wanted a white woman instead. To catch his eye, a black woman would have to be twice as gorgeous and twice as successful as an average white woman!!!  A sensitive issue Although some would prefer to sweep the issue under the rug, interracial dating is still a very controversial subject in the black community. Yet anyone who dares to question almost any form of interracial dating is immediately challenged, criticized and dismissed by the "PC police." Those involved in interracial relationships are often the most sensitive about the issue when questions are raised. For the record, I think adults should be free to date whoever they want. I have dated a virtual rainbow coalition of men in my life, including blacks, whites, Latinos and Asian-Americans. Today I prefer white men, but I would not entirely rule out the possibility of dating someone of my own race. Interracial dating doesn't bother me. Nor am I bothered by segregated dating, as when whites prefer other whites or blacks prefer other blacks. I think this is a natural extension of our comfort levels with people like ourselves. Nevertheless, such preferences "” particularly when they become absolute exclusions "” could reflect some level of sel loathing. Why do we exclude our own? What does concern me is when black men consciously choose not to date other black women. I can understand when a black man dates outside of his race. I cannot understand when a black man refuses to date within his race. Such exclusion, it seems to me, is rooted in deep self hatred.  |
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Founder |
quote: quote: Honestly, there doesn't seem to be too much distance between your position on dating and the one you decry in black men. You say you would not "entirely rule out the possibility" of dating a black man. Perhaps I am misreading you, but you seem to have a rather strong opinion about this in black men, yet exhibit similar behaviors yourself. Is "self hate" at the core of your dating choices?  that is less than the one you are capable of living. - Mandela |
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D3 |
>>>>Honestly, there doesn't seem to be too much distance between your position on dating and the one you decry in black men. You say you would not "entirely rule out the possibility" of dating a black man. Perhaps I am misreading you, but you seem to have a rather strong opinion about this in black men, yet exhibit similar behaviors yourself. Is "self hate" at the core of your dating choices>>>>>>
I NOW advocate that ALL black women DATE out!! Not exlude as many black "men" do to them, of course not. But date out? You damn Skippy!! lol. Don't get territorial now, just sit back and watch the change that's a comin'  DATING out and EXPANDING your dating options is FAR from SELF HATE bud. I love my blackness and I can be with a good WHITE MAN AND BE BLACK ALL DAY LONG!! Sorry I can't say the same for many black men. Not only are they EXCLUDING their entire FEMALE race and have the damn cojones to say it is "preference" LOL... They also raise children like Tiger Woods, the ones that say they are CABLINASIANS!!! My dad never said he was a Blindian for crying out loud. America is going to SMACK of South Arica as we allow these WEAK ass black men and their dysfunctional and oh so afraid white women (eek, I f***ed him but now I have a BLACK kid!!!) create another RACE.. the further segmentation of a raicst society, history repeats itself.. Well dear, in the long run, WHITE is an exclusive club. Everyone wo in NON-white, regardless if they call themselves "mixed", is NON-WHITE!! Accept YOU blackness, love it and form a political base to effect change or sadly, continue on like your weak "black" Uncle Tom fathers and live the existance of an empty shell that desperately needs a soul breathed into it. |
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D3 |
Another reason to DATE out, not exclude, but date out. There are only 5 black men for every 10 black women. 1 of those 5 is gay, 1 is in jail, 1 is on drugs, 1 will only date white or light, and that BARELY leaves 1 that BETTER BE YOUR TYPE!!! LOL. WAKE UP!!!
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D3 |
Statistics put Ray in the majority......A black man is 60 per cent more likely to have a relationship with a white woman. Historians may point to the legacy of slavery which gave greater desirability to women with a lighter skin tone.
??WHITE GIRLS ARE EASY??? Writer – Tony Snow Do white women really deserve the reputation of being labeled easy? Does the same notion really do justice to the complexity of black masculinity and interracial relationships? And where does this leave black women who by this reasoning, are paying the price in being ignored by black men for being seen as too self-reliant – read hard. Publisher and broadcaster, Dotun Adebayo who presents White Girls Are Easy discovers that this way of thinking seems popular among black men. Most white heterosexual men are likely to dismiss the notion outright. 'Ray', a black man, who has reached his mid 30s without ever dating a black woman, offers some insight into the debate. His theory is that white women are not necessarily easy, just easier than black women. His take on the issue is not uncommon because like many black men, he has capitalised on the notions that eternally surround black masculinity – such as virility and being well equipped. Indeed Ray's courting ritual is exclusively based around and dependent on it. While out clubbing he embarks on a series of stage-managed moves once he has a girl in his sights.He usually begins with a grand entrance; a slick move on the dance floor to grab the attention. Then in deliberately unsubtle fashion will sidle up to the target and his ice-breaker consists of grinding his hips in close proximity as she looks adoringly on. His technique, which is based entirely on the brazen confidence he exudes, proves highly successful with white women. The thought of trying a similar technique on black women sends shivers down his spine. "It's not that I don't like black women" he points out. "It is just that I have always assumed that black women would never be impressed by that sort of thing. They may think ' yeah you're a good dancer - so what?' I never had the nerve to risk it." Ray suspects that this fear has been brought about by the prevailing nature of black women. "They tend to come across as very inhibited and more concerned about how they will be perceived." For Ray flirting and acting sexually provocatively is "all part of the game", but he feels black women are reluctant to adopt this role. However he firmly believes that if he could crack this outer layer, then there is a soft centre, but he admits that he has never developed the weaponry to chisel away at this 'case hardened shell'. Statistics put Ray in the majority. A black man is 60 per cent more likely to have a relationship with a white woman. Historians may point to the legacy of slavery which gave greater desirability to women with a lighter skin tone. For white women inter-racial dating still remains a novelty. There are approximately half a million black men in Britain, but over 25 million white women. Perhaps some white women that opt for black partners do so out of curiosity and to experience first hand if the prevailing myths around black manhood are true. In order to find a black partner, such women may make themselves more available than to white suitors, thus reinforcing the reputation that they are easy game. Some white women may be drawn to black men because of their confidence and ability to assert their masculinity to a greater degree than many white men. But love does not discriminate. If two individuals find a connection, race and culture are immaterial. Adults in their 20s and 30s, possess fewer taboos about inter-racial dating and than their parents did in the 1960s. A hybrid culture has emerged as a result of 50 years of multiculturalism from which younger generations from all races can tap into. However where cultural differences due to religion and language remain more apparent, as in the case of British Asians, there is less inter-racial dating. There is now a further twist with the emergence of a 'new breed' of white woman who date black men. She is the independent go-getter, who is strong willed and takes control of her own life and relationships in much the same manner that black women have been doing for years. Was the resilience and independent spirit of black women the catalyst for the failure of black men to sustain relationships with them? If that was the case, who will black men turn to, now that white women have cultivated similar traits? Will black men finally move into the 21st century and learn that in modern relationships control must be shared? Or will they simply move on to the next unsuspecting racial group? Black women are no longer waiting for Black men to decide. It is apparent that they now are the next big movers into the inter-racial arena. The traditional conventions surrounding dating have been blown out of the water, and quite literally, everyone is up for grabs these days. |
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D3 |
"In these bloody days and frightful nights when an urban warrior can find no face more despicable than his own, no ammunition more deadly than self-hate, and no target more deserving of his aim than his brother, we must wonder how we came so late and lonely to this place"
-- Maya Angelou Internalized racism is an aspect of racism seldom addressed, but an aspect that is very real and that has tremendous consequences for persons of color and marginalized persons in this country. Although I think that this aspect of racism affects all persons of color, as an African-American I'm going to limit my comments to the African-American experience. I would define internalized racism as the conscious and subconscious incorporation and acceptance of all the negative stereotypes and images from media, folklore, accounts of history, and so forth, that define persons of color, and especially African-Americans, as inferior. |
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D3 |
He was just 30 at the time but had found a wide following with his call on blacks to first liberate their minds from white domination, urging that the "most potent weapon in the hands of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed."
S. Biko |
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D3 |
we must remember that it was the Black Power Movement that challenged good people to be great and great people to be greater. It was this movement that challenged Dr. King to evolve analytically to the point where he was hated, hunted and killed by the very country that now claims to honor him. It was Black Power that brought into being the Black Panther Party, the Black Liberation Army and Guerrilla Family whose members were (and are) hunted down, imprisoned or killed as a result of their unrelenting desire for power, i.e. freedom. It was Black Power that brought about Black Studies and academic insurrection. It was Black Power that encouraged students to, at times violently, take over universities and administration buildings demanding that they be offered courses that taught the history, politics and economics that we still need and do not get. This perpetually assaulted academic movement is attacked to this day not because it is intellectually inferior but because it is a living descendant of uncompromising Black Power.
Black Power influenced the world. From Steve Biko's Black Consciousness Movement in South Africa, Amilcar Cabral in Guinea-Bissau, Sekou Toure in Guinea, Kwame Nkrumah in Ghana, to Fidel Castro in Cuba and Maurice Bishop in Grenada. Black Power touched all who sought revolution. In America it influenced the American Indian Movement (AIM), Latin American groups such as the Young Lords and supportive white radicals. To this day its influence reaches younger generations through organizations, some educators and musicians from Dead Prez and The COUP to Blackstar and Jill Scott. But it needs to be properly studied and discussed. We cannot let yet another symbol be diminished regardless from where it comes. The Black Power Movement was not a peace movement. It was an assertive response to a lack of justice, a lack of freedom and a lack of peace and its symbol should remain an unblemished example to today's struggling people. |
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D3 |
He was just 30 at the time but had found a wide following with his call on blacks to first liberate their minds from white domination, urging that the "most potent weapon in the hands of the oppressor is the mind of the oppressed."
http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/respect.rm RESPECT 1967 http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/russell/11_16/revolution.rm[/URL] Gil-Scott Heron - "The Revolution will not be Televised (1971) http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/russell/11_30/black_n_proud.rm James Brown 1969 http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/revolution.rm "N-words are Scared of Revolution" (1970) They play ball while the white man cuts off their balls........ http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/radical_man.rm Radical MAN (2000) http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/russell/11_16/whats_going_on.rm Whats going on (1971) http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/order.rm "New World Order) Curtis Mayfield http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/little_child.rm Curtis Mayfield (1971)..Little child running wild http://kola.cc.columbia.edu:8080/ramgen/itcmedia/marable/ballot_bullet.rm Malcolm X - ballot or the bullet "Before a group can enter open society, it must first close ranks." Malcolm X -- Usually when people are sad, they don't do anything. They just cry over their condition. But when they get angry, they bring about a change Without education, you're not going anywhere in this world You're not supposed to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who says it If we don't stand for something, we may fall for anything |
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A1 |
quote: 60 percent more likely than what? And do you really believe that a majority of black men have never dated a black woman? If so, your opinion is beyond (or, should I say, BENEATH) reasonable discussion. |
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D3 |
quote: The article was written by a well respected BLACK MAN... not me... but all you have to do is look around at the fact that a black man is 60% more like to be with a white woman.. lol. 98% of ball players are WITH NON-black women... that includes celebrities... go to CALI or Boston or Minneapolis or DENVER... and TELL me what you see BUB??? lol AHEM!! 60% is NOT all black men... |
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D3 |
quote: While almost 96 percent of married white women have white husbands, the researchers found, fewer than 93 percent of cohabiting white women live with white men. White women are 3.5 times as likely to live with Black men as to be married to them, and they're also more likely to live with than marry Asians and Hispanics. Hmmmm, makes one go hmmmmm?? Could it be true... that not only do BLACK MEN NOT marry black women, ahem.. they also don't marry their white women??? The University of Michigan News and Information Services News Release 412 Maynard Ann Arbor, Michigan 48109-1399 March 23, 2000 (21) Intimate relationships between races more common than thought LOS ANGELES---Intimate partnerships between the races---estimated at more than 5 percent of all marriages in the United States---are much more prevalent when cohabitation is also considered, according to a University of Michigan study presented here today (March 23) at the annual meeting of the Population Association of America . While 25 percent of married Asian women have white husbands, for example, nearly 45 percent of cohabiting Asian women have white partners. And while 17 percent of married Latino women have white husbands, about 22 percent of cohabiting Latino women live with white men, The study was conducted by David R. Harris and Hiromi Ono, both sociologists at the U-M Institute for Social Research (ISR), the world's largest academic survey and research organization. For the study, Harris and Ono analyzed 1990 U.S. census data for Black, white, Asian and Latino couples between the ages of 18 and 30, who were either married or living together. "Cohabitations are not a trivial share of young people's unions," Harris and Ono report. "Among the four racial groups we examined, about one in six unions is a cohabitation. Just over 16 percent of unions for Asians, Latinos, and whites are cohabitations, and more than 25 percent of unions for Blacks. So focusing exclusively on interracial marriages, as most previous research has done, seriously underestimates the extent of intimate contact between the races." In general, whites and Blacks were much more likely than Asians and Hispanics both to marry and to cohabit with their own racial group, the researchers found. But within each racial group, there were slightly different patterns, depending on gender as well as type of union. While almost 96 percent of married white women have white husbands, the researchers found, fewer than 93 percent of cohabiting white women live with white men. White women are 3.5 times as likely to live with Black men as to be married to them, and they're also more likely to live with than marry Asians and Hispanics. About 96 percent of married Black women are married to Black men, compared with about 94 percent of cohabiting Black women who live with Black men. But while Black women are more likely to live with than marry white and Hispanic men, they are no more likely to marry Asian men than to live with them. About 69 percent of married Asian women are married to Asian men, while 25 percent of married Asian women have white husbands. "But as common as marriages are between Asian women and white men, cohabitations are even more prevalent," says Ono. "In fact, Asian women are more likely to be living with white men than with Asian men. Nearly 45 percent of cohabiting Asian women have white partners, while less than 43 percent have Asian partners." About 80 percent of married Latino women have Latino husbands, the researchers found, but only 73 percent of cohabiting Latino women have Latino partners. About 22 percent of Latino women are living with white men, compared with 17 percent who are married to white men. In their analysis, the researchers also assessed patterns in interracial relationships for males. "Perhaps because of their position at the pinnacle of racial and gender hierarchies, white men appear much less willing than white women to enter into relationships with Blacks," they note. "Only six-tenths of 1 percent of cohabiting white men live with Blacks, for example, while about 2 percent of cohabiting white women live with Black men. In contrast, about 12.5 percent of cohabiting Black males live with a white partner, compared with almost 4 percent of cohabiting Black women." In general, the researchers found that Black, white, Asian, and Latino men and women consistently choose to cohabit with people who are different from the people they marry. For all of these groups, cohabiting unions are more likely to be interracial than are marriages. "Our findings suggest that there is much greater intimate contact between the races than marriage data imply," says Harris. "Consequently, the social distance between racial groups is not as great as other studies suggest it is." |
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D3 |
quote: In terms of inter-ethnic unions, 'Black Other' men were more likely to have white (52%) than 'Black Other' (42%) women as partners [Table 7.9]; for both men and women alike and for most of the ethnic minority groups, the younger cohort (aged 16-34) were more likely than the older groups (aged 35-59) to have white partners, with the 'Black Other' men and women having the greatest tendency [Table 7.10]. Controlling for social class and educational qualifications, 'Black' men were the most likely to have a white partner and, for women, the 'Other-Asian' group were most likely to have a white partner. |
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A1 |
quote: Go to New York, Philly, Newark, down south, Washington, DC, or Chicago. Ball players do not make up the majority of black men. But at any rate, you didn't answer my question: 60% more likely than WHAT? What does that statement mean? Are they 60% more likely to have a relationship with a white woman today than 50 years ago? Than a white man is with a black woman? Than they are to eat raw asparagus? 60% more likely than what? This statistic is meaningless without a "than," so we know what he's talking about. |
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D3 |
How does the shortage of marriageable black men relate to the women in your book?
The common wisdom in the black community is that the more successful a woman is, the harder it is to meet a partner. And the numbers bear that out: when we do marry, black women are far more likely to marry a man who earns less than we do than our white counterparts. |
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D3 |
quote: Whoah!! You have comprehension issues...let me type this slowly.. Than dating a woman within THEIR OWN RACE!!!! lol.... d i d y o u g e t t h a t Norman.. h e l l oooooo Mr. Bates?? |
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A1 |
quote: That stat is obviously, completely unsupportable. In the United States, most black men date black women. To say that the average black men is that much more likely to date a white woman than a black woman is to say that a majority of women that the average black man dates is white. That is false. |
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D3 |
quote: |
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C4 |
This thread isn't about "Black Male Self-Hate..." it's about GinaMarni.
Perhaps the thread should be renamed, "GinaMarni Wake Up, Shut Up, and Get the #%*& out" ... eh, maybe not. [ignore] |
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D3 |
quote: Go kiss or beat your white girl and don't worry about Gina Marni. Let's get a little more creative and intelligent with you point of view, huh?? lol.. Self hating fools with heads in the sand... lol |
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